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The article (read Jonny’s: Lemond swings yard) describes today’s Interbike conference with Lance – with Lemond asking a few questions re: Armstrong’s proposed bio – marker transparency in cooperation with Don Catlin.
Lemond has a point, vo2 and power output are very important indicators when assessing enhanced performance manipulation. This is fundamental exercise physiology. It is surprising to see Mr. Catlin’s claim of: “that’s not my area of expertise.”
It is also interesting to note that Coyle, who published an eight year case study on Armstrong in 2005, has LOST some of the raw data.
From my experience conducting human studies, it is an IRB requirment that all data be kept in locked files.
Have you ever seen a power file from a tour contender on the last climb when it is do or die? The SRM displays shown on VS. often show the power for a mid pack GC guy while riding mid pack (drafting) – and this display often omits Watts and replaces it with elevation. Is elevation even displayed on a normal SRM? Powerpeaks had planned to post power files from several TdF teams but this is all I can find (2006 Van de Velde and Jens Voight).
I do remember Powerpeaks having a blurb about how the teams were not releasing files? Maybe someone out there knows more about this? Point is, to my knowledge, there are no real data available on the people that win grand tours, especially in the Armstrong era. Doesn’t seem transparent. If I was winning those big races, I’d be posting my files on DC every day!
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Lemond does indeed have a valid point. But that doesn’t excuse that he is now and has always been, a complete and total dick.
For a so called scientist, you are missing a lot of fundamental facts yourself. What is Powerpeaks? And you don’t even know if SRM displays elevation. How can you even comment on such things when you don’t even know?
And why would you release your power files and output? That’s like showing your cards in a poker game. You have to keep them guessing, right?
Also, haven’t I seen you post that Lemond has the highest recorded VO2max. Does that mean he’s a doper, too?
Sounds like you just can’t accept the fact that there are outliers in every aspect of life. What about the recent Olympics and Bolt? Did we ever imagine a man could run so fast or is he just a doper? Is Bill Gates a doper, too? Who else is doping in your world?
Bill Gates is a proponent of rideclean!
Go Greg go.
No bigger dick head in cycling than Lance
Why does every American cyclist that wins (or maybe cheats his way to a win) the Tour have to answer to LeMond? Who died and made Greg the all time authorative figure on US cycling in Europe? His antics come off as a bitter old man that can’t accept the fact that someone else in the US won the Tour, cheating or not.
Another great point that is never brought up by Greg is how did he hold the Tour TT record (for the fastest) for so long, against riders that were obviously doping and on better equipment?
Elevation can be displayed on the new wireless SRM when used in conjunction with the Garmin 705…I would think Lactic Threshold to power would be more beneficial than V02 max in terms of a minipulation measuring stick.
I feel like after a long night eating and drinking and what not my v02 and power go way down. But I can only tell because a slight hill has my head spinning and heart pounding.
I agree with the idea that there is data you may not want to release to your competitors.
While the idea of maintaing data locked away is nice, I think by now we can see that the laboratories and scientists involved in the sport are prone to less than desirable adherence to Good Laboratory Practices.
As for Lemond, either he is a bitter old tour winner who can’t stand to see others put him in the shadows, or, maybe he is so pissy because he is right and knows it. Hard to say.
Any studies out there showing expected changes in VO2 max/power changes from natural training compared with “enhanced” training? Be curious to see the differences.
As for data release to ones competitors: Why would it matter if they know you’re strong? They already know that. They still have to beat you up the hill with whatever power they have in their own legs.
Well, for what it’s worth, Floyd Landis did provide his power output data in the 05 and 06 tours. Clearly, not sure what that proves, or disproves, in any case.
http://www.bicycling.com/tourdefrance/article/0,6802,sl-7-123-12161-1-0-0-0-1542,00.html
…greg lemond = lead poisoning = addled brain = bitter man = enough said…
It’s already been said, but bears repeating:
Lemond is a dick.
One of Armstrong’s reasons for returning to the sport is to reemphasize the need to battle cancer. If he suceeds in getting the world to focus on that, I don’t care if he rides around France in July with an EPO pump strapped to his ass.
Tell me what cause, other than tearing down other American Tour winners, Lemond has dedicated himself to, and I’ll be quiet. Until then…
Ya..and I can’t wait to see Schleck in next year’s tour as well!
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news.php?id=news/2008/sep08/sep27news
BTW…John The Lawyer…I agree 100%.
…lemond gets invited to participate in various charity rides & thus his name is “associated” w/ certain causes but you are quite right, john the lawyer…he’s not making a real stand for anything but self promotion, despite his assertions that it’s for the sport…
…do i think he loves the sport ???…100% hell yes, not a doubt in my mind…do i think he’s going about his propagation in a self centered, idiotic manner ???…100% hell yes…
…lancestrong & his large ego might not be subtle, but he steps up to the plate & he does it knowing full well that he’s under a microscope (quite literally, once again)& that no matter how well he represents a cause he seriously believes in, that he will encounter loud mouthed, publicity seeking naysayers…
…lemond is fast devolving from a “great tour winner” into an embarrassing curmudgeon…if you think it looks bad now, imagine him 10 years down the line when he’ll be wheelchaired, drooling, into events in a straight-jacket…
…“yep, he was once one of the tour greats, believe it or not…absolutely magnificent in some of his battles on the bike but he could never reconcile himself to not being considered #1 & look at him now…such a shame really…
…what’s that ???…oh, the other guy in a straight-jacket w/ greg ???…that’s dick pound”…
all will be settled…there is a suit right now. Someone will flip on Lance eventually. Do the fucking math guys. I mean Lance has done more for cancer than anyone, can’t take that away. But think of all his ex-teammates that have tested positive or admitted to EPO use. Lemond is going through his mid life right now and throwing up his past on everyone, but that does not mean that he is wrong.
and FYI his VO2 crushed Armstrongs…and he still could not hang in the 90’s. I would be fucking bitter too.
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i don’t think Greg ever learned that in certain situations 1) you can’t win and 2) trying just makes you look bad
@John the Lawyer:
“Tell me what cause, other than tearing down other American Tour winners, Lemond has dedicated himself to, and I’ll be quiet. Until then…”
You might want to check http://www.1in6.org and get quiet.
One cause that can be seen as pretty embarrassing and that somehow is not embraced by many celebrities… probably because it takes more than guts to do it.
Just as it takes an incredible amount of courage to try to uncover the truth about someone that some people blindly admire, so much that doing it will invariably make you be called an old bitter jealous dick. I think LeMond really doesn’t care about that.
Cycling has gone through an incredible downward spiral with the Armstrong years. There was some hope things could get better without him, but he decides to come back, and he says he’ll now be “transparent”. Armstrong then needs to be transparent about his past too, but he clearly refuses to do it. In the press conference, he kept on repeating people had to “move on”… Transparency is just a nice PR trick.
Congrats on LeMond to be able to show that Armstrong is willing to be transparent only on what he decides.