To piss or not to piss in the soup, that was the question.

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So by hunting down riders in the peloton and telling them they’re hated by their fellow riders for pissing in the soup, one has pissed in the soup?

Arguably,  the most successful cycling  team ever, has given up and allowed its riders to go find work elsewhere.

Discovery is Kaput. 

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About Bush43

“Long time cyclist, skier and purveyor of all that is good in this life.” SLC, Utah, USA

36 Replies to “To piss or not to piss in the soup, that was the question.”

  1. Like an american team could ever win the tour…
    no, wait.

    Like a CLEAN american team could ever win against those evil Euro Dopers.

    Fuck the Tour, fuck the tour, fuck the tour.
    La la la.

  2. This was coming but, man shows the big corp america cant get its
    shit together with some sports.. dope or not.. we have kids breakin
    into this sport.. or tring tooo.. mom and dad say play baseball..

    Black Flag!!!!!!!

  3. “I have never doped and I have never participated in an act of doping,” said Contador, reading from his prepared statement Friday. “I won the Tour clean. I cannot understand the attacks against by people that don’t even know me. My commitment is absolute and I will always be ready to collaborate in the fight against doping.”

    Over & Out

  4. “This is arguably the most successful sports franchise in the history of sport,” stated Stapleton.

    Uh, dude, the Montreal Expos (the worst team in baseball), in their worst year ever, probably did 4 times the business you guys did during your PEAK.

  5. bang bang the disco’s dead. long live rock n roll. oh wait, those guys have a rep too. when in doubt, retire. ah well, vaughters will carry us to the promised land. what the hell is hincapie doing in pink? how much longer will amgen front the TdC?

  6. OK, then. Faema. Eddy Merckx’s team. Quite a bit more successful in that regard. Renault/Elf/Gitane. Shit, I could go on and on.

  7. Slipstream should be chomping at the bit to sign some of the Discovery boys to the team. They say they don’t think they can make all three tours, but in a drug free year what team will? With the blue train on their side how could they go wrong. This is gonna be fun, WEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!


  8. Faaaaaascinating. I quote myself from my own blog:

    Armstrong said:

    ” Clearly things need to improve on many levels, with a more unified front, before you would see [Threshold Sports] venture back into cycling.”

    Wow – way to abandon cycling, big man! Especially when the bike industry has claimed that it’s the “Lance affect” that’s gotten so many new riders out on bikes across the country. And further, Bob Stapleton, general manager, says:

    “We were in talks with a number of companies about the opportunity and were confident a new sponsor was imminent. We have chosen, however, to end those discussions.”

    What the hell does that mean? We had an offer but we turned it down? Why, because they weren’t offered enough money or – and this is merely my humble opinion – the powers that be were closing in on the truth, namely that the entire team is a product of a very expensive, very secretive “medical program,” ordered and orchestrated by an aggressive Armstrong, and getting out of the sport now will save their hides? Don’t quote me on that, but why the hell else would “arguably the most successful sports franchise in the history of sport” (Stapleton) get out of the sport now?

    With both statements coming on the same day, it looks to me like they’re just throwing poor little Contador to the wolves. I wonder if we’ll hear from him again.

    Hm, so there’s a ProTour team license floating around out there now, huh? And suddenly, inexplicably, Jonathan Vaughters is the biggest man in US cycling, as the boss of his “alternative” US-based Euro pro team. Who would have imagined that?

    Like I said, faaaaaaascinating.

  9. “ordered and orchestrated by an aggressive Armstrong”

    Uh, you need to get introduced to Thom Weisel someday. If you think Armstrong likes winning, then you have not met Weisel.

  10. hey question all,
    I think this Sat ride should be in respect for disco team..
    and support of the sport.. road/dirt whatever.. just come out
    and ride where u live.. smile and ride..

    Have a Beer after and cheers to good things to come.
    together we all can come together for the good of pedeling/racing
    or just whatever :)this sport is great and the people can be even


  11. From Velonews: “Tailwind officials were apparently unable to parlay a series of eight Tour de France victories over nine years into a satisfactory sponsorship arrangement.”

    I’m sure they had plenty of people willing to buy the title sponsorship, but those marketing execs are not stupid. They know that the team has been devalued, and at least partially due to their own poor decisions (Basso, etc). You are dealing with huge egos here. Armstrong does not want to be affiliated with anything that cheapens his “brand”. Weisel wants no involvement unless he is going to get a nice chunk of profit out of it. But knowing Weisel, he’ll regroup and form something else. Unfortunately, Vaughters has snapped-up all the “available” premium American riders. They’ve inked their deals too, so Leipheimer is screwed. I predict he’ll end up on CSC.

  12. I say if Contra-fucker gets thrown to the wolves, he should really throw down. Say what he did, and then REALLY name names. Who did what, when, everything.

    I know if I got throw out with the bathwater after carrying LA’s ass-wipe attitude, I would be ready to do whatever to bring the whole establishment down; who cares about people saying ‘Sour Grapes’ and all that.

    Lance Armstrong never did anything for cycling in america that ddn’t benefit Lance Armstrong. Ever see him donate to an injured cyclists fund? Ever promote better cycling laws and more bike lanes? Community awareness??? Any of that?

    He’s a selfish prick who did it all for Lance Armstrong; not any of us poor (and clean) schlubbs.


  13. It IS a sad day, I agree. The Big Top is folding up their tents & the circus is leaving town.

    The air kinda went outa me when I read the article.

    Like ’em or not, vilify ’em if ya want, but don’t deny the fact that the Postal/Disco teams raised the profile of cycling for the better in this country, despite the constant allegations.

  14. Oh, right, I forgot! Half ‘a’ you fucks wouldn’t have anything ta wheeze about without ’em.

    I know what. Lets put our differences aside, pool our money & form “BIG JONNYS DRUNKCYCLIST PRO-BIKE RACING TEAM” –‘Just Babes ‘n’ Booze — No Drugs Allowed’

    $45 mil can’t be that much & I’ll make the signs for the clubhouse.

  15. bikesgonewild:

    All the rise of USPS/Disco did was help allow Thom Weisel seize control of USA Cycling. Have you seen any significant grass-roots racing improvement or outreach? No. All of the money has gone towards the elite level. Want to know why most road racers in Colorado do not race in USAC events now? Because they took back control of their own racing dollars. Weisel has compltely screwed-over USCF/USAC racing as far as domestic development of talent.

  16. Patrick, while I don’t claim to know all the machinations behind the scenes @ USACycling, I agree w/ you. I’ve posted on DC before saying they’ve definitely got their own ‘hidden’ agenda.

    I’ve got friends in the bike racing ‘business’ & I’d be afraid to mention their names cuz they’d take shit from the hierarchy of US cycling ‘associations’.

    I give Weisel credit only cuz he does ride his bike. A short fat man on a bicycle,all kitted out in Postal/Disco livery, here in the Bay Area. Too good to acknowledge the likes of you or I in passing, however. Not humble Tom.

    No, my comment was a reflection on the fact that more ‘citizens’ are familiar w/ cycling now, & ultimately thats probably better for all of us, out on the road.

  17. In summary, if you loved them or hated them or indifferent to the Tailwinds teams, they were “America’s” team and it’s sad to see it’s over. Now we have to learn to like argyle.

  18. Cheers to Johnny V. & the (hopefully) dope-free Slips. He promised next years team kit colors are gonna be bright! Cool.

  19. “namely that the entire team is a product of a very expensive, very secretive “medical program,”
    Un-fucking-believable. What on God’s green earth gives you the insane idea, that Disco could run a “secret” program without some of the ex-riders that left, pissed of and on at and by Lance, wouldn’t and haven’t ratted that one out. Maybe Lance doped, though I still doubt it, but a secret medical program? Did the Pope beam you that one via the transmitter the aliens left in your ear? Frankie the Rat would have been spraying that one as soon as Disco fired his publicity seeking ass.
    It won’t be six months before some of you half-wheelers are pointing at Slipstream, and crying doper. Go jack off on your signed Lemond poster again.

  20. “Un-fucking-believable. What on God’s green earth gives you the insane idea, that Disco could run a “secret” program…”

    Exactly…I mean there is no secret about it…look at all the dopers associated with LA and there is no secret.

    LA given a pass for “medical” treatment…and all I can say is who cares? Glad he is gone, hope he stays away. Can’t wait until “fairness” is handed out to FL.

    The biggest point…Many, many racers are idiotic losers. I see way most people don’t like cyclists clogging the roads.

    I’m glad 15 years of the drug wars escalating are almost over. I hope they keep kicking losers asses until there are none left.

    And speedy, keep sucking the dicks of those losers you are trying to defend.

  21. divert I must

    jonathan vaughters is the man now. His concept is for real yo. JV keep it up and keep the burns and the TNecks as well

    Go Slipstream/McDonalds errr I mean..

    although bikepunk probably already knows this and probably already posted it: chipotle is part of McDonalds and their Chicken Burrito is one of the top 10 worst fast food meals you can consume.

    -1,180 calories and 19 grams of saturated fat as three 6-inch Subway Steak and Cheese Subs. Plus, it has 2,900 mg of sodium! Getting the burrito with no cheese or sour cream cuts the saturated fat by two-thirds, but you still end up with 950 calories and 2,690 mg of sodium. Yikes! –

    all good but don’t get me started on Felt frames…

    and BikePunk you the Yoda of this hood. word

    Fuck Lance and Fuck Discovery

    lets move forward with JV and his crew. Although the Euros will likely take their time granting him a Pro Peloton now to keep us yanks away

    Poor Levi dude just can’t get over

  22. “And speedy, keep sucking the dicks of those losers you are trying to defend.”
    This would infer that I am a man and that I don’t enjoy sucking dicks.
    In all seriousness, asswhipe, if you read my post, I am not defending anyone. I am just saying that this unrealistic, ridiculous statement that there was some secret medical scheme that Disco had is just outright stupidity. Do you really believe that in America, where cycling is a backseat, who-gives-a-fuck-about-it-wheres-my-waltrip sport, that a cycling team would have a doping regime that T-mobile, or Mapei didn’t figure out first? Get fucking real. If it was out there then Ulrich was doing it too. And if it the mystery drug exsist then why didn’t Landis, Hamilton, Andreau, and Heras take it after they left Discovery or tell someone about it.
    I have said this before and I’ll say it again, blaming Lance for cyclings problems is like blaming Clinton.
    It’s your fucking heroes that are cheaters, too.

  23. I just heard on C-SPAN that Disco is being revived with Dick Cheney as DS. Their super-secret black medicine is going to enable them to win the War on Doping. Team cars? Hummers.

  24. speedy, lol…good post and some good points, except for I don’t consider any of those people heroes, just some of them are disgraces and I’ll be glad when they’re gone. The only other point, some cyclists, just like some people simple don’t and won’t use drugs. I look foreward to this whole thing being less of an issue.

  25. …jeez, don’t know about you, but I could use a hummer about now.

    This constant drug shit is taking its toll on all of us.

  26. 1972-2002 – Didn’t do much
    2003 – Watched Lance win the Tour; got inspired
    2004 – Biked a lot
    2005 – Biked some; picked up running
    2006 – Biked some; ran some; picked up swimming
    2007 – Two centuries; Two triathlons; 1/2 marathon; numerous 5Ks

    Since 2003, I’ve followed the European peloton nearly every day. I’ve discovered the fun of exercising and the beauty of cycling. The US Postal and Discovery Channel cycling teams have given me years of entertainment, inspiration, and patriotic pride. I know I’m not alone. Even two years after Lance retired, I still see half of the riders in my local competitions wearing the yellow Livestrong bands. I also wear one, not because I know someone that has cancer, but to remind me to live strong every day. I don’t doubt that Lance is a selfish prick, but do you wish that he had not inspired millions of cancer patients and cyclists to give it all they’ve got?

    Simply put, athletes race for themselves. Although the common good of a sport is an incidental benefit, athletes compete for individual purposes, not to satisfy others. It’s the same reason politicians do what they do. It’s just like Adam Smith’s “invisible hand.” Those that try, succeed. And those that follow, benefit.

    Tailwind Sports has stated that they had at least one sponsorship, but chose not to take it. Whether or not this is the case, who can blame them? I check the cycling websites every day, and these days pretty much anticipate hearing about a positive doping test rather than a good racing result. One previous comment to this post said that $45M was not that much. Are you crazy? Asking a sponsor for $45M in the current climate is nearly as bad as asking for a corporate sponsor for the Iraqi government, especially with the war between the UCI and the Grand Tours. McQuaid, the president of the cyclists’ association, was not even allowed to come to the Tour. It seems that pro cycling will have to get worse before it gets better.

    As for all of you that disparage Lance and the US Postal/Discovery team, what is your motivation? I usually like the underdog, but what will the sport profit from their failure? Will OLN/Versus air the Tour next year? They used to air the the Giro and Vuelta. That’s not happening now. Do you expect them to jump on the Slipstream bandwagon? I surely will follow them, but a new cycling team will not get the attention that Discovery commands.

    I guess that those of you who want this sport to be out of the spotlight have won. Congratulations. You can count on your local rides to remain small and unsupported. Just realize that your bitter attitude precludes others from enjoying our great sport.

  27. Adam Smith’s “invisible hand”?

    Oh Jesus Fucking Christ!

    “Motivation” to disparage Lance Postal / Discovery?

    Oh Jesus Fucking Christ!

    Now it’s the people who talk about the drugs in the sport guilty, not the drug takers in the sport?

    Oh Jesus Fucking Christ!

    The good done Cancels Out the path taken?

    Oh Jesus Fucking Christ!

  28. are these guys allowed meds when it hurts when they pee? alll the euro trash girls over there throwing themselves at dudes gott give the clap to one of them

  29. “1972-2002 – Didn’t do much
    2003 – Watched Lance win the Tour; got inspired”

    So you were a non-athlete and not involved in comptetion? The answer for you as to why people think what has happened is fucked up might be what most of us got from participating in competition our whole lives. Sportsmanship, playing by the rules, stuff like that. Cheating ruins competitions. How would you feel if a co-worker got a bigger raise or promotion because they lied about you or took credit for your work?

    There is also those folks who use drugs, some of them just for recreation. They seem to feel drug use for any purpose, including performance enhancemnt is legit.

    If you are a sports fan simply for entertainment (like a television show or WWF), then cheating aint gonna mean shit to you. If you are a “sportsman”, were brought up to play fair, shake hands after the game and have integrity, then your gonna be annoyed.

    As for your economics arguement, it shows your attitude towards sports. Unforetunately it is all about the money for a lot of people, not about the competition.

  30. Thanks for being easy going Racers…About your and my heroes being dopers, unfortunately all my heroes are. Pantani,Merckx,Museeuw,I even used to cheer for Frankie The Rat until I met the asshole. It sucks but most of them not only dope, but they got caught. Maybe someday Lance will get caught too. But at least for now I hope he was clean.
    Look at the responses on this board and you’ll see how fucked up this really is. Everyone of us loves cycling, and everyone of us has been screwed by it.

  31. Okay. I was very drunk when I wrote that post, and pissed off about the departure of Disco and the current state of pro cycling. I may not have done this my whole life, but trust me when I say that riding my bike and following the American and European pelotons are my greatest pleasure (behind my wife and kids, that is). I guess I’m just defensive when it comes to the team that inspired me and changed my life so much for the better.

    Bush43, you should consider calming down. I’m guessing that your bitterness makes your life suck. Just a hunch.

    RacersandRaceFansRlosers, I get your point that it is unfair when dopers beat the clean cyclists. I’m starting to get the impression that every cyclist that does great things may be on the juice. I’m even to the point that I think Postal/Disco simply had the best undetectable doping program. However, until the day that their doping program is proven beyond accusations, I will stand by the team that inspired me so much.

    By the way, I don’t have an economics argument. You appealed to me about having an unfair situation in my employment. The question is back to you. Would you invest $45 million in a team right now?

    On another note, why do the positive tests always belong to the GC guys and never the sprinters? Are the sprinters on an undetectable juice, besides salbutimol, or whatever Petacchi tested positive for?

  32. ” Would you invest $45 million in a team right now?”
    No chance. If I had $10 trillion, I wouldn’t support professional cycling as it exists now, not a dime.

    As far as you waiting for a positive test on disco, how many more positive tests do you want? LA had a sample that tested positive for EPO, it just didn’t meet the requirements to be actionable. Do you really think he stopped receiving medical treatment (ever)? If you like him and you like the team, good for you (seriously), but it and they were what they were. If you want to say it is okay because they didn’t have courtroom level proof, good for you, just realize those who see the other side aren’t that far off base.

    As far as your love for cycling…fantastic. It really is one of the best things in life and I’m glad it brings you pleasure. Hopefully one day it will bring you pleasure without any of the sideshow that it has become.